Episode #20 House Hacking with Jonathan Farber


Show Notes:

Episode #20 House Hacking with Jonathan Farber                                                                                                                                          In this episode of Real Estate Investing Made Simple, Jonathan Farber talks about the ins and outs of the House Hacking strategy.

Jonathan is a 27-year-old house hacker and now a multifamily investor.  He has 6 traditional units in Raleigh NC and 2 short term units in Pinehurst.  He works with virtual assistants to manage time while working a full-time job.  He is now working on acquiring 20-40 unit multi-family deals.


Contact Jonathan Farber:

Facebook Group


Book recommendations:

Best Ever Apartment Syndication Book by Joe Fairless

The One Thing by Gary Keller

Podcast Transcription: 

Introduction  0:02  

Welcome to The Real Estate Investing Made Simple podcast, the show empowering and educating people on how they can grow, manage and protect their wealth through real estate investing. Now, here’s your host, Bailey Kramer.


Bailey Kramer  0:22  

Hello and welcome back to the real estate investing Made Simple podcast. The goal of this show is to break down complex real estate investing strategies that you can use to grow, manage and protect your wealth. I’m your host Bailey Kramer, and today we are joined by our very special guest Jonathan Farber to talk with us about house hacking. Jonathan is a 27 year old house hacker and now multifamily investor. He has six traditional units in Raleigh, North Carolina, and two short term units in Pinehurst. He works with virtual assistants to manage time while working a full time job. He is now working on acquiring 20 to 40 unit multifamily deals while


Welcome to the show, Jonathan. Yeah, excited


Jonathan Farber  1:02  

to be here pumped to dig into the conversation.


Bailey Kramer  1:06  

Yeah, absolutely. So why don’t you go ahead and start by telling the listeners a little bit more about your background and how you got into the real estate investing side?


Jonathan Farber  1:13  

Yeah, absolutely. So I was not traditionally into business or real estate when I was growing up, I was very different than the person I am now. Actually. It’s kind of a transformation. But more or less I was into golf in high school just picked up the game from a funny story, actually, but we don’t need to get into that. But that was pretty much all I thought about when I was in high school and going into my potential college years and just thinking I wanted a golf scholarship. So that was pretty much all I thought about and went to Hofstra played golf there and just, again, still was only focused on golf was not focused on school business. As I look back at kind of my tendencies i do i do jump into things and maybe that’s why one of my favorites business books is the one thing but again just all into playing golf as I got more towards the my junior and senior year I was I guess 20 or 21 at the time, started thinking more about, you know, call it like next steps work, you know, career what I want to do with my life, the whole thing. And at that point, I had a couple mentors that I found just through local campus stuff that worked at software companies. So I started working actually at a software company out of college. And in doing that, I had to move to Raleigh, North Carolina to start working there. And I’m from Long Island originally, so when I first got down there, I’d never been but it felt like everything was half price or like monopoly because everything seemed so cheap compared to where I was coming from in Long Island where it’s just insanely expensive. But I was down there for a couple months was living in a one bedroom apartment like a luxury apartment. I think it was like 900 and $900. I was like this is this is amazing. But at the same time I was still really into personal development and business.


Learning and I was really focused on just trying to be successful and doing whatever it took. So at that time, I started following a couple real estate people, a friend of mine recommended BiggerPockets, which I’m sure we’ll talk about. It’s an amazing forum for learning I kind of called bigger pockets like Facebook, for real estate. It’s just basically your community where you can learn anything and meet people hear stories, but got really into that. Another thing that I find myself doing a lot, I kind of just jump in and take a lot of action. So I started reaching out to every single guest on the podcast, I think I reached out to like the first hundred 50 or 175 guests, just for virtual sessions, pick your brain, whatever, questions and after about three months of doing that, I realized oh my god, I’m actually wasting so much money renting and paying $900 a month when I should be building equity and buying something. It’s appreciating city. So I wanted to full like pivot mode. And all I started thinking about doing was how do I house hack at the time, like I wasn’t making a ton of money. I wasn’t making not a lot of money. I was also in a commission based role. So


started college I think I was making like $75,000. And it had uncapped commission. So like, again, I had a little bit of a base, but I was also a really big saver. And I was living below my means after I kind of had this realization. So


Unknown Speaker  4:13  

went out and


Jonathan Farber  4:14  

probably saw 45 units or properties, just totally no idea what I was doing. But I knew that okay, if a house hack or rent out the other rooms and everyone around me is looking for a place to live and they want to live with friends, then Okay, I guess like, it could offset so I kept the way that I find I could just always move forward to real estate is ask myself, what’s the worst thing that could happen? And I just kind of kept doing that. So bought the first one. We could talk about how I found any of these deals, but nothing really special just on market MLS deals, found it lived in it for a year. Rinse and repeat. I did it again the next year and I did it a couple times. And then in I did that for three years and then the fourth year or third. At the end of the third year when I was in Raleigh, I found a four unit property that I could buy and live in and that ended up being Something that I did. And then I had to move back to New York. So then I converted them all into rentals moved back to New York. And there and now, I’ve done a couple other projects since a flip in Long Island, which was a huge pain in the neck. And then I added to short term rentals. And yeah, so I sold one of the other rentals that was down here. And now I’ve just been doing all cash out refinances on the property so that I can be as liquid as possible and stable as possible to do my next multifamily purchase in the range of 20 to 60 units value at the middle of the country. So that’s my real estate story. And I still have a full time w two job, which I am just a time management, I guess not freak, bhature, whatever you want to call it. And that’s pretty much how I just chunk out my days and my weeks to make sure that I can be focusing on the right things at the right times.


Bailey Kramer  5:52  

Wow, wow, that’s incredible. So to kind of take it back to that first deal and the idea of house hacking. Can you just kind of break down Briefly know the idea of house hacking for those who don’t know.


Jonathan Farber  6:03  

Yeah. So this is the main question I get now being a 26 year old investor and working a lot of money on investors is what’s the best way to get started. And I have three favorite ways. But this is without a doubt the number one way because house hacking, I guess just by definition, it’s a term that became popular on bigger pockets. A friend of mine now who are just a bunch of people talk about it, but Craig Karloff wrote a book, he worked at bigger pockets. And he kind of became the house hack guy. But Brandon Turner, one of the other BiggerPockets hosts also talks about a lot. Basically, it’s as simple as this. You buy something you live in one part of it, it could be a multi family, one to four unit or it could be one house and you live in one part and you rent out the other parts and you essentially live for free or totally offset your cost of living. And the beauty of doing it this way is that as a 2122 or just beginner, everyone needs a place to live. But also banks have such different limitations if you live in the property. So You live in the property, you can put down three and a half percent. And that’s not a lot of money, you can find a $200,000 house and put 10% down, rent out the other rooms and you live for free now maybe even make money to live. But I hear it so many times people say like, Oh, I got to put 20 down or 25% down. It’s just not true if you live in it and do this strategy. Now, granted, you will pay PMI which is mortgage insurance, but that goes away in most loans once you get to a certain point. So it’s really not a big deal. Like it’s not a limitation at all. But that is what house hacking is.


Bailey Kramer  7:30  

Awesome. Awesome. So let’s kind of talk about your first deal, your first house hack and kind of dive in that.


Jonathan Farber  7:37  

Yeah, like as vanilla as it gets, like as repeatable as anyone listening could ever want to do. I just went out and looked at 40 properties on the MLS that were under 200,000 which I did hear a couple people say like, oh, if you’re gonna buy a single family home and it’s not in a really crazy appreciating market, you might as well try to stay under 100 50,000 at the time, so that’s kind of what I was shooting for. And then just analyzing deals from calculators I found on YouTube or bigger pockets or whatever. But just went out and saw a bunch of properties, went back home would plug these into my spreadsheets had no clue what I was doing literally no clue. I was just like guessing I’d call people and say, Hey, what do you think about this? I think I’m going to do this because also I was building those relationships from reaching out to people on bigger pockets. But it was it was an MLS deal. It was a condo, it was a three bed, two bath, and I just got it under contract and had two roommates friends that would live with me. And that was it. And I remember thinking like, Man, what if I can’t even find the two friends that live with me? And it’s just gonna sit empty or vacant. I was like, You know what, my mortgage would be $700 a month. I’m paying 900 now so like, Who cares? Like why not do this and learn and get the experience. So that was the first one. Awesome


Bailey Kramer  8:57  

and what types of properties were you looking Were you looking strictly at condos or were you? Because that’s what one way you could also look at duplexes. You can even do it with a single family house if you’re renting out the rooms. What was your focus when you’re looking?


Jonathan Farber  9:11  

Totally. I think for beginner, a condo isn’t such a bad thing if the numbers still work because you are protected against a lot of the major expenses that could pop up on a property like I think condos or Hoa have this like really bad stigma. Don’t get me wrong, they suck like they’re total like crap. But for a beginner who isn’t really ready to take on an unexpected expense of a roof or leak or maybe a foundation issue. an HOA actually could be great for stuff like that like as training wheels, but I wasn’t looking at that specifically, it was just those were more than the price point that I could afford on that first deal. You know, because it’s like the economics of it. If you go on the MLS it’s an interesting standalone houses are probably 40% higher in price, then condos or townhomes, but that’s because they’re almost like They’re offsetting costs just by that Hoa fee you’re paying every month and the economies of scale by everyone living together and supporting a community. So single family homes are much more expensive. I don’t know why at the beginning, I didn’t really look at it. I didn’t really I kind of wanted a little bit of training wheels. So I was looking at condos and townhouses, but I don’t think it necessarily makes a big difference. If you can find a property. That’s the right price point for you, and it’ll cash flow. And you’re willing to take a little bit more risk or like hands on stuff on a single family. I think that’s totally fine.


Bailey Kramer  10:33  

Gotcha. And do you remember any of the specific numbers maybe how much you’re charging your roommates or how much cash flow you’re getting?


Jonathan Farber  10:40  

Yeah, I have loosely. I think the property was like, purchase for like 112,000, which for coastal investors, you’re probably like, how, but for you know, condos or townhomes in these cities, you could still you could still find something maybe like 130 140 they’re not trading at that much higher, but The mortgage was 500 a month and the HOA was 200 a month so 700 I guess you would call and that mortgage was was piti principal interest tax and insurance for those that are wondering like how do I calculate my expenses? That’s the main thing that you need to account for principal interest tax and insurance from there. You can account for management or other expenses, but those are the main ones and then I had an HOA fee. But it was $700. And I was I think they were they were everyone was being charged 500 a room. Even myself, I charged myself. So um, we all paid insert it’s 1500 dollars a month and yeah, right. That’s cash flowing. It was like I guess maybe 650 there were maybe some other expenses and little things that popped up but yeah, right. There is an example of like, how it works and why it works.


Bailey Kramer  11:53  

Right. So once you kind of, you know, you bought the condo you had your your friends as your roommates. Was that like a light bulb that went off for you? What was that? What was that turning point for you to say, you know, or was it there was a turning point I said, I want another one. Where do you kind of go from there? Yeah,


Jonathan Farber  12:11  

it kind of gets addicting. Like for me after that first one, it’s just like, you’re making money to do nothing. Like you’re literally like the first time I think I realized that you can make money while you’re just sleeping. Like if you really think about it, like your cash flow for the month is by day or by hour, like, then it dawned on me and then I mean, like, I kind of downplayed it a little like, I am an obsessive reader and learner. So like, then I got more into it and more into and the more people I talked to, I kept thinking to myself, like wow, this person can do it, I can do it. You know, like not that like down like knock on anybody, but it made me realize how much more doable it is and how much more possible it is to fall in someone’s wake. Then like starting an app or a software, company or business we have all these employees. This is like the everyday person’s world. To wealth that anyone can do. So it might not be the fastest way. But I really do think it’s like the best hybrid approach to fast and like, simple. But yeah, after that, it was like, how do we do the next one? So and one like, I didn’t rush into it, because there’s a lot of learning on that first one, but just like continued so then I was like 22 had, you know, one deal under my belt, I thought it was great. You know, looking back like just great learning if someone does a first deal and it flops totally fine. Like at least you did something. And making money in the first deal does not matter. It’s not a good thing to ever lose money, but at the same time, like, I think people don’t calculate the cost of not doing anything, like there’s no dollar amount you could put on that but in 10 years, if you’re not anywhere where you want it to be like you lost everything you had, you know, like I’d rather at least learn as I do it. So yeah, it was pretty much after that, like the momentum was there and the flame was lit and for now for now it just like even Even more, it’s grown even more.


Bailey Kramer  14:02  

Awesome. And you still own that first condo that you bought?


Jonathan Farber  14:06  

No, I don’t we sold it actually. And I don’t know if I cared a lot, I would have kept it or not because like that area is whatever, and I use the money for stuff that I needed at the time. But now my approach is more don’t sell. Just cash out, refinance and hold.


Bailey Kramer  14:21  

buy and hold. Gotcha. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Gotcha. And, and so after this first one, you know, you said you kind of got the urge and you’re kind of addicted like I needed another one. Did you buy another condo after this? Or did you take a different route?


Jonathan Farber  14:37  

I did. It was actually a townhome. And it was in a better area. And it ended up having a tenant in it already. It was an MLS deal. Had a tenant in it already was under paying a little bit but very stable. And yeah, that was that was the next deal.


Bailey Kramer  14:55  

And did you use realtors to help you find these properties they said is on MLS Did you have access to it? Or did you use someone else to help you out?


Jonathan Farber  15:04  

I use a realtor I you know, for anyone listening wondering like, should I or should I not using one as a buyer, there’s really no downside because the seller pays the fees. So, at that time, I was still a beginner and I needed help finding stuff. So it was definitely beneficial.


Bailey Kramer  15:24  

Awesome, awesome. Mm hmm. And so to kind of take it back and break down a little more the the three and a half percent thing that you’re talking about putting the downpayment, can you kind of talk about, you know, some specifics of how that actually works? And is it repeatable Can you do that for for multiple house hacks? Yeah, I think you can.


Jonathan Farber  15:47  

I think you can do one a year like so the three and a half percent down it’s it’s an FHA loan. I don’t know what that stands for. But it’s a should actually, but it stands for something that means you can put three and a half percent down To buy a property now you do have to fit in their box of how much you make and what your credit score is. But I’ll say this for anyone listening to this, like if you’re listening is I would assume that you’re already there. Because it’s not crazy. Actually, I think there might be an amount that you can’t make over. I don’t know the details about also, I haven’t done one in like five years. But I’ve you know, or you could just do a traditional low downpayment live in property. So like you buy a property that you live in yourself and put 10% down. And that way, I don’t think you have to worry about qualifying or not qualifying for anything, it’s just something that you’re going to live in. So that’s pretty much either of those you can call banks, and you can find banks through bigger pockets, Facebook, googling local banks, and just calling them and saying hey, here’s what I’m thinking about doing and get their opinion or feedback if they have a program that works for you.


Bailey Kramer  16:51  

Okay, awesome. And do you remember that extra insurance that’s that’s placed the thing he called it pidyon PII insurance.


Jonathan Farber  17:00  

So it’s either MRP or PMI. Again, I don’t know what that stands for just all these like acronyms in real estate. It’s hilarious. But it was, yeah, that’s what it is you have to pay it anytime you put less than 20% down on a mortgage. But the difference is with an FHA loan, this is actually useful. With an FHA loan, it never goes away. So you have to refinance the loan to get rid of it, which is kind of a burn. But if you do a traditional loan and just put down 10%, the PMI will go away when you get to 20% equity, meaning if you put 10% down on $100,000 property, once you’ve paid into it, and now you’ve paid into it 20,000 the PMI will go away. So that fee will go away and you can cash flow more.


Bailey Kramer  17:45  

Okay, gotcha. Gotcha. And, and besides the, this extra insurance, are there any other downsides to house hacking, that that you kind of found along your way


Jonathan Farber  17:57  

some people don’t want to live with roommates. Some people don’t want to live next to their tenants if they live in like, I’m going to quad Plex right now just fixing it up and I’m here just for like the short term or not short term. I’m here like I’m in Coronavirus, and yeah, like there’s a part of me that living next to my tenants isn’t ideal. Like, they could knock on my door. Or like I could I also see stuff that was out of sight out of mind before that, like, bothers me now, that never would have bothered me before, but it’s like, Alright, like, I see this guy literally never takes out the garbage or like, he leaves this crap in front of his like door all the time. So it’s like, before I didn’t know that was happening. It’s like, I don’t care. You know, I didn’t hear about it. But now you know, whatever. But yeah, I would say just falls into that bucket of like, these are tiny sacrifices for the potential benefits that it can have on your life. Like this is not living on the street, and living in a one bedroom apartment with five people. This is literally a tiny change in quality of life, maybe living with friends or having 10 next to you, that will change the entire trajectory of your future. Like, I think that’s what people kind of don’t think about this is like, these are slight tweaks that will totally change your path in 510 15 years. Like, I don’t know that many 30 year olds, I’m 26 but I don’t know that many people that I can say I’m gonna be financially free by 28 like 30 at the worst 30 is like if I have a huge failure, but like, most people are like, I can’t wait for 60 and I’m like, 60 like, you’re gonna be dead. Like, why, you know, like, you have it all backwards, like, do these things while you’re young. And you can before you have all the baggage, like, I’m single still, you know, like, I’m not running to get married and have a kid and like, again, nothing wrong with it. Like I think the whole thing that comes back to it is like the balance of sacrifice first, like, wants is what makes you happy and what are your goals and for me, like I’m constantly thinking about that reading, reflecting, talking mentors, coaches and like, tiny sacrifice, you know, but Okay, just answer the question. What some people would say is, I don’t want to live with roommates. I don’t want to live in that part of town or I don’t want to live next to my tenants. And I say, Okay, then you don’t want this. And that’s totally cool, too. But if you say you want it, and then you say that, I say you’re soft, and good luck.


Bailey Kramer  20:19  

Yeah, yeah, totally. I mean, it, there’s there has to be sacrifice involved, for sure. And if someone doesn’t, you know, isn’t like open that open to living with roommates. You could go, you know, the duplex route and live in one half and rent out the other, you know, might not be as ideal and, you know, the numbers could may or may not work, but, you know, there’s definitely sacrifice that that’s involved.


Jonathan Farber  20:46  

One comment on that, I’ll just say this. I moved down here when I was 21. Okay. And basically, at that time, I thought I had a lot figured out and I thought I was making good money. Okay, so last year That year, maybe I made 70 grand, maybe maybe 80. Okay. And I was living way above my means even for Raleigh, North Carolina, not even like my friends. I live in New York. Like they’re 2122 they move into New York City, they’re paying three grand for an apartment. They’re going out like, like, every night, like different place, whatever. I’m like, dump, like just that is dumped, and you’re crippling yourself, but like, so here’s where I’m going. That is at 2122. I was like thinking that way here. Now. I’m 26. I made more money last year than I’ve ever made my entire life significantly more every year. And I’m literally cutting my cost of living every year. And it’s that combination that I’m thinking like, that’s how I’m going to be financially free 28 Okay, because the more I make the less I spend, like, I don’t have the creep. But most people it’s literally the second they make any money. overspend then they make a little more money overspend even more and it’s like,


Unknown Speaker  21:56  

Whoa, like,


Jonathan Farber  21:58  

now I just made all these horrible decisions. I’m stuck in. So it’s like, just, again, like evaluate it. And what I asked myself is like, Am I doing this? Because it makes me happy or am I doing it because I think I need to and the person next to me is like, I don’t like to drink. I used to love to drink. I used to be like a nutjob. But like now drinking and going out doesn’t make me happy. Like I don’t even enjoy eating in restaurants. Like I like playing golf and being outside in nature. And like, if I’m going to spend money, that’s it. And I like the idea of building something for business and you know, helping other people. So like, that’s what makes me happy. So that’s what I’m going to do and like it just happens to coincide with the business stuff. So these are big sacrifices. Let me just say that like, people that know me, like, I’m not living like a peasant, but at the same time, like I’m not doing dumb stuff.


Bailey Kramer  22:45  

Yeah, yeah. And, and something that the house hacking really like comes to my mind is, is Robert Kiyosaki. He always talks about, like, is your house an asset? And, for the most part, the answer is no your house Not an asset. Unless if you do something like the house hacking strategy, where, you know, the house is actually paying you. And, you know, you know, you’re not just you’re not taking your hard earned money and putting it in the house, the the opposite is actually happening in the house is paying you. So that’s just a strategy that I think, especially young people, instead of buying a house, which isn’t a liability going into the house hacking strategy is, you know, living pretty similarly with little sacrifice, but turning more into an asset and a liability.


Jonathan Farber  23:37  

Totally. And like, I don’t knock people when they they hit me up and they’re like, I just bought a house like I’m investing in real estate. I’m like you I’m like, nice. Like, if they’re my real friend, I’ll give them feedback. Like, nah, like, I get it. It’s like the thing you’re supposed to do, but like most people are poor. So like, the thing that You’re supposed to do or that most people do is is wrong. Like, because there’s not that many people that are rich. So like, the other thing, I mean, I’ve said this many times, but like ties into this is, I only take advice from people that I admire or would trade places with. If someone is broke, and they’re giving me advice about money or they’re divorced, and they’re telling me how to date, I’m like,


Bailey Kramer  24:20  

just back off, like,


Jonathan Farber  24:21  

good. You know, like, I don’t need that I want I need the knowledge from the right people. Like some people say you can learn from people that that did it wrong. I’m like, Yeah, I don’t need that. Like, I’ll learn from it. Right.


Unknown Speaker  24:33  

Right, right. Yeah, I’m with you on that one, too.


Jonathan Farber  24:37  

Yeah. And that’s so you’re doing this that’s how you’re doing such a great job branding and building your network and doing these like, you’re surrounding yourself with all the right types feel and I’m not even saying I am taking me out. I’m whom I’m literally no one. But you’re I see you’re networking with Rod kalif. And you’re like, Andy and all these other people. That is how you level up and you keep swapping information with the people that are in places that you Want to be? And that’s probably my my only invest advice for anyone listening to this, like, what do I do like trade up like my even old high school friends. Now I still love them, they’re still my friends but like, I don’t talk to them as much because like my circle now it’s all people that are doing it and think differently. They’re the ones that are doing all these things and they’ll be successful. So like, that’s so important,


Bailey Kramer  25:24  

for sure. And something that you said before that that was just really always on my mind too is if everyone’s doing it, it’s probably not the thing you want to be doing just because if you have that goal of being, you know, financially free and and reaching that level that most people are not, then don’t do things that everyone’s doing, because it’s right and normal. That’s just, you know, you have to do the things that only the small percentage of people are doing, because there’s only a small percentage for a reason. Fact yeah So what I mean, if you mean, this house hacking really works for anybody, but if you could, if you if you could be talking to one audience right now and really just, you know, preach the idea of house hacking, or any type of real estate investment, but starting with house hacking, who would be your ideal audience?


Jonathan Farber  26:21  

Dude, everybody, like the question I get kind of back to the beginning is how do I get started? And like, there’s a couple of ways I say depends, do you need a place to live? Do you want to do it locally? Or are you investing for just cash flow? Like, it does depend and most people don’t know that. And again, that’s because they’re not conditioned to know that because it’s go get a job and what’s cashflow? So like it depends what you’re interested in like, so I asked people, they say I don’t want to invest that estate. And I’d say okay, if you want to actually do this and get started then it’s either buy or rental locally, which means you need 20 or 25% down and that’s Means you probably don’t have that. So you could either borrow it from a friend or family, or you could house hack and put down a lot less and get started. So anyone really listening, I’d say like, if you live in New York City and you’re obsessed in New York City or San Francisco might be a little harder. And it might maybe not be possible but that would then go back to that little bit of sacrifice conversation. Okay, if you need to move to Westchester or jersey or Long Island, like then it is doable, but by in New York City, you know, even 5% of like a million bucks is still on, you know, so like, whatever. It depends what you want to do. But if you’re in like any other part of the country, like I have a lot of friends out in Louisville, or they’re Indianapolis, or Ohio and they house hack and they’re doing amazing with it. They make money to live. They do it every year and their net worth and their wealth is growing so much, but yeah, really anyone that’s looking to get started I’d say for sure it’s the best way or for people that are just maybe looking Gonna try it or try investing and wouldn’t mind living in a duplex or quad with tenants on the other side’s Awesome. Awesome.


Bailey Kramer  28:09  

And before we move on to the next section of our show, is there any last piece of advice any last piece of information you want to share about the house hacking idea or just getting started in real estate in general?


Jonathan Farber  28:22  

I want to say just take action because that’s that’s the most plate that’s almost as played out as people saying what their favorite book is on bigger pockets. I’ll say this. Networking is probably the most important thing that’s hiding in plain sight. Like set a goal to reach out to three to five people a week and you’ll be amazed at what your life becomes virtual coffee, pick your brain belly. I know you do this as well as anybody but it’s just like, that is the key. Like no matter where you end up, if it means you need help with something if it means you need advice, if it means you need to raise money one day, people are the game and I used to think Do it a little bit more in a silo, not so much anymore. And it’s all about and how like people are like, how do you do that? How do you build your network? Well, one, if you’re under 30, most people will just get on the phone with you. But in general, maybe for like add on it, the way to do it is to try to add value one step further. Everyone also throws that out the worst generic advice in the planet. How do I add value? I have a full template of the 15 ways that I like to add value, I could post a link and if anyone wants it, they can either just email me or join the Facebook group. But a couple of the ways are just support people’s content. Like Share it on LinkedIn, share it on Facebook, screenshot it, share it on Instagram, dm them with no ask and say this is amazing. endorse them on a social media platform. If they do a podcast. Get some people on their podcasts, like getting guests is a really hard thing. So go out to people in your audience or network and say, Hey, this podcast is awesome. I want to connect you to people. We’re literally I mean my other favorite one is just Literally asked, What can I do for you that you don’t like doing right now? What is an annoying thing you have to do every day? These are my skills. I don’t feel like I have even that many skills but like I have time, so what could I help you with? And I know people don’t like that as much, but it’s still better than just reaching out and asking for something with for nothing, but if anyone reaches out, I’ll pass that back over to you. The full ways that like I like to the full list, but it’s just people.


Bailey Kramer  30:26  

That’s it. Okay. Awesome. Awesome. And, and it’s funny because the things you just mentioned, they’re all completely free. It takes no money to, to post something on social media to comment on someone’s posts. They’re there. They’re almost like so simple, but yet makes such a big impact. And the fact that they’re, they’re free and so readily available for everybody. it you know, I overlooked that too, in the past, I’m now realizing but it’s really available for anybody who who wants to build relationships and grow your network?


Jonathan Farber  31:01  

Totally. I mean, the last thing I’ll say, I mean, I when I do it, and I really want a mentor or someone to help me, I go all in. So like I said, Joe fairless a 15 point, like business plan are the things I can do to help him so that I can get around him. And he responded, because I’ve watched his content for a month. And I was like, I think I can help you with these specific things. So I’m not asking for formal mentorship, but I want to be around you more, and I want to do it through value add. And he responded. So that’s the game. And now he’s in my network. And that’s cool, because he’s my multifamily idol.


Bailey Kramer  31:41  

Awesome, awesome. So we’re now going to move on to the next section of our show, which is the big four where we ask all of our guests the same four questions. So So Jonathan, number one, what’s your number one habit for success? Hmm.


Jonathan Farber  31:57  

Small, consistent measures. I’m not about Big like, go out and do something crazy once and you’ll never want to do it again, like go to the gym for four hours, and then your body’s dead. Like, start small. So for me right now, I just set small lead metric goals that I know I can achieve. So like right now for me, it’s analyzing one meal a day, very small, very simple. I know if I do that. I and I can do that. It’s a SMART goal, meaning like it’s measurable, but attainable, then I know I’ll make an offer every week or 10 days. So small, consistent actions.


Bailey Kramer  32:30  

Awesome. Awesome. And I actually just wrote an article about that type of idea. And I’m not gonna go too deep into it, but it’s the idea of massive action and massive results. You know, doing something so small is that’s really the massive action you’re doing. But but it’s the key thing is consistency. So doing something very small. I mean, it takes time for sure. But, you know, one deal a day. It’s nice, easy broken down. And ultimately that’s going to lead to your massive results. Then people are gonna look oh my god, you’re making massive action. And it’s really it’s really just from a small, consistent things that you’re doing.


Jonathan Farber  33:08  

Totally. And it feels like it has to be doable. Otherwise you start feeling bad about yourself and you don’t do it. Well, yeah. If my thing was I’m gonna go to the gym every day for two hours, like maybe I can do three days in a row. fourth day, I’m like, I can’t my legs, I can’t feel my legs. And like, I can’t do it. And then I’m like, I missed a day I’m missing another day, and then it just stops happening. So like, small, like I said, my favorite book is the one thing, go along with your goals, and then go tiny with your lead measures and just stack them up. That’s it.


Bailey Kramer  33:39  

Awesome. So number two, limiting beliefs are thoughts in our heads that hold us back from realizing our potential. What is one limiting belief that you were able to crush and how did that impact your life? Dude,


Jonathan Farber  33:52  

these are good questions. I like this. Um, it would it would probably be most recently creating content and having a imposter syndrome about helping other people and teaching other people. I was like, I hate units. I’m 26 Who the hell am I to be putting out content or helping people or delivering value? And it’s like, you know what, that’s such a wrong mentality, I realized that it’s actually a disservice to not try to help people with your experience because you’re being selfish. So that was a huge one for me. And now it’s just been like, getting more consistent and taking lead measures with creating content and helping people and it started out and again, let me let me say this guy’s like doing a selfie video at the beginning for me is probably the most uncomfortable thing I could have ever done. I’m like, you’re a loser. Like Who are you to think that like you could just now I’m like, you know what, I change the mentality. I’m like, Okay, one Why are you thinking that to like, it’s to help other people and three like now becomes fun. So like, the podcast started out as once a week. Now it’s going to daily, like creating YouTube content. The Facebook group like that was a limiting belief that I definitely but also as I started small with and now it’s grown, I guess it started with like a tiny thing. And now it’s just like, Oh, I’m a little more comfortable. I’ll step out a little further, a little more, and then it just keeps progressing.


Bailey Kramer  35:08  

Awesome, awesome. And number three, what advice would you give to someone who’s considering investing actively or passively in real estate for their first time? I know you kind of case in tipsy for but just another other piece of advice.


Jonathan Farber  35:22  

Yeah, I’ll go a little different direction with it still about people. But


now I’ll go good. Two quick ones. One, find a mentor through value add, like I would find I would listen to all the content you can find the 20 people that you admire, and I’m literally giving you some advice just because this is the advice that I took. Find the 20 people you admire, and reach out to them saying, I How can I help you? I heard you mentioned this you need help with and I’ll literally do your laundry and I’ll cut your grass. And I will analyze every deal for you. I’ll do whatever but I just want to be around you. So find your mentor that will fast track everything you do. And the other thing I don’t have any But a great book free to focus, I would start implementing more leverage earlier to like now I have three full time virtual assistants who help me with analyzing deals doing the podcast and then just like other executive administrative tasks that I just don’t like doing. I wish I would have done that sooner. Because I kept thinking that I have to do everything, but it’s like no, if I hate doing it, but it still has to get done. There’s likely a way it can be done by someone else.


Bailey Kramer  36:25  

Awesome, awesome. And the fourth one, you’ve kind of touched on two different books that you’ve that you’ve really enjoyed. But the question is, what is your favorite real estate business or personal development related book?


Jonathan Farber  36:36  

Dude, we got there everywhere these days. I’m trying to figure out my new living situation. I’m


best ever syndication book is the best real estate book I’ve ever read. Because it reads like a hand right? Yeah. Joe fairless. It reads like a handbook of step by step. What do you need to do like some books I read a lot. So my biggest gripe with business books is the first third is almost always fluff. Like I don’t need to know why I want to do this like I’m here like I want to do this. So like just let’s go through the steps but his book it is a handbook of literally day one start doing this that’s the reason I started the podcast. He’s like, you need to start building a brand start a podcast, I was like, Okay, I’ll start a podcast today. So like that’s really good. Love the one thing I’ll go a little off the cuff here young young audience will not know any of these or this one but um Atlas Shrugged by Ayn Rand. You might know it just through the Jake and Gino guys. I think that’s honestly why they named the group Rand group. But it’s a long book about capitalism and just about business and basically becoming something and just an amazing story. It’s not like a how to book it’s just a great story and a difficult read but an incredible read. So I guess those couple


Bailey Kramer  37:52  

Okay, awesome. Awesome. Thank you. And I haven’t read that book, but I was actually searching through my book. I found one that was by Rand. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that one? Yeah. I remember. Yeah. I remember Mark Cuban. I saw on some random list that Mark Cuban recommended it. And I was like, I guess if Mark Cuban recommended it, I’ll give it a give it a shot.


Jonathan Farber  38:19  

That’s his number one recommended book, but it’s a really hard read. So I don’t recommend it too often, but I don’t know. One for a curveball.


Bailey Kramer  38:26  

Yeah. Awesome. So Jonathan, Where can the listeners get ahold of you?


Jonathan Farber  38:31  

Yes, the best way and the most top of mine way for me right now. It’d be a Facebook group that I run and organize. The name might change. But if you just look up Jonathan Farber, millennial real estate investor, you should be able to find it or I think right now it’s just labeled millennial millionaire through real estate, or millennial Millionaire Mastermind, but that’s probably the best way. I’ll give you my email. You could pop it in here. If anyone wants to connect to reach out or Instagram I actually only on there on the weekends myself, and then I have just virtual assistants running it Monday to Friday. But I still love to connect with people on there. It’s an awesome way. So that’s just JONJ fa RB. So yeah, please do not hesitate to reach out if you have any questions. But I’d love to have any beginner investors in the Facebook group or anyone that’s looking to get started, reach out and connect.


Bailey Kramer  39:22  

Yeah, any of those ways. Awesome. And and also you run it, you’re on a podcast as well. You might like me, I’ll share sharing the name of that listeners.


Jonathan Farber  39:32  

Just add it to the list. No, I didn’t really like that. I just forgot I have a horrible memory. It is called the millennial millionaires through real estate podcast, very similar to your show, beginner oriented podcast with just people that I admire. And the same thing we really dig into just how to choose and the one thing that we talked about a lot that podcast is like the actual tool. So instead of saying like, let’s just raise money, I want to actually talk about like, what’s the conversation What’s the contract? Say? Who needs to sign it and all the details of it that I felt like I never really was able to pick up from a lot of other podcasts. So that’s the gist of mine, but you’re doing a great job. If anyone’s here, you know, maybe you’d like mine. But you know, yours is awesome to appreciate it.


Bailey Kramer  40:17  

Well, Jonathan, it was a pleasure having you on the show today. Thank you so much for adding value. And you know, going through the house hacking strategy, I know it can be a huge benefit to a ton of people out there. So thank you so much. It was


Jonathan Farber  40:29  

a pleasure, man. Really enjoyed it.


Introduction  40:31  

Thank you for listening to the real estate investing Made Simple podcast. For more resources or to connect with us further, please visit our website, www dot Bailey kramer.com. We’ll see you next time.